CONGRESS. PHILADELPHIA HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, SATURDAY, March 31. In committee of the whole on the report of th; Secre tary of th: Treafnry on the public debt ; the fijib proportion reported by the feletl committee refpells a further assumption of the State debts, was read. MR. GERRY ofFered a few remarks on the fubje<ft—and urged the jallice and found policy of compleating a buiinefs which had for reasons well known, been left in an unfin ilhed state ; but which equity and precedent now called 011 Congress to finifh. Mr. Clark was opposed to the proposition Mr. Hartley : After so long a difculfion my attempting to take up any great length of time would not be excusable, but I consider it my duty ro fay a word or two in answer to some expreflions and observations ui'ed against the con stitution and operation of this government ; and give a few realons why I (hall now vote for the resolution under consideration. it will not be necellary for to rake into view the principles upon which the constitution was framed ; they were fully examined in the ge neral convention as well as the several State con ventions, ank ltood the test of the ftridteft scru tiny. They are favorable to liberty and justice. As to tlie operation of the government we may best understand it, by contrasting the state of America at the adoption of the constitution with the present day. At the former period our credit as United States of America was at a low ebb. Few of the individuals of foreign coun tries would give a credit to the individuals of this. The capitals of Europe would not be trust ed in America.—They doubted our justice as well as our government ; there was scarcely any credit given to individuals here ; a nniverfal diftrull prevailed. Agriculture languiflied ; the farmer diffident—he had loft his confidence ; the great fpuv to indultry was wanting.—No (hips on our flocks, few veflels in your harbors— commerce decoyed ; the vital spirit loft. I might fay more—but I will turn from a difigreeable scene to one more pleasing. What is our present (late ? The credit of our government is as good as that of any country. Individuals of all nations will trust the individu als of America. Individuals here (until a late unfortunate bubble or abuse of credit, arising from bad men or bad management and which will poflibly only do hurt for the moment) gave full credit to each other as far as their capitals extended, as well in the city as in the country and confidence prevailed. Agriculture where the people are indtiftrions and apply their attention to the raifiug of thole articles which are most in demand, is in the highest improvement ever known here before I can speak with confidence of the State I live in. The idle and indolent can expert no great cess in an art which depends upon the (teady hand of industry. There are ships on the stocks in every part where there are fliip-builders and materials. The tonnage 1i 11 will evidence the mighty increase of the American shipping ; It has far exceeded the most sanguine expectation. Several of the firft merchants state your commerce in a molt refpedtable situation far beyond any other pe riod. Indeed, the returns from the Secretary of the Treasury (hew la iw great our imports and how vad our exports. In point of juitice our reputation (lands high with the world. Our courts will do justice. Pray what foundation for thole llrong afler tions which have been made against tution and the government ? As to the funding system I shall fay little at present. I much doubt if it deserves' the hard names which have been given it. Abuses will be committed in ail countries ; no human plan can be secure against them. The afl'umption of the State debts was fully considered upon a former occasion. Severkl of us wilhed to fund the debt of the union alone, many gentlemen of the south when we came to look for ways and means, voted against us, and the eaftei n 1 eprefentatives were always ready to join in defeating us, unless the aflumptiou of State debts also rook place. The bill pad the House of Representatives for funding the debt of the union alone; but the Senate lent it back with an amendment aHinninn State debts to a certain amount. After much ar gument the amendment of the Senate was agreed to by the House of Representatives. Jufticewas nearly done to some States ; others do complain and 1 think Rhode-Island with much real'oii. I could have wiftied that the accounts between the United States and the several States had been fettled. But I will give the gentlemen who complain so much, an opportunity of fatisfying this house (if they are able) when the blanks are to be filled up in the bill, that the funis they de mand-are reasonable and are intended to give re lief to the people of their States. 1 will vote for the resolution Mr. Find i-e y, in answer, faicl :—lf I am not altogether so elated with our present profperitv and resources, as my worthy colleague who is jult (at down, laffure you 1 am not despond ing 1 think our relources are competent, and our circunidances not deprefled ; the great indultry of our citizens, and the great de mand and high price for our produce in foreign markets, which took place about two years ago, gave a spring to our wealth and industry, and fornilhed ample resources to government ; our feelings have not been pierced with the cries of general distress, nntil very lately, through the abuse of the novel principles introduced in the funding system. But though I rejoice with the gentlemen 111 the fufficiencv of our means, yet I consider our selves in the (ituation of an unexperienced heir, newly come to the enjoyment of a great estate, who, being dazzled with his own splendor, and confident of his means, sets about spending with out fyltem or principles, and gets embarrafied before he is aware. We are told, that the principle of afluming the State debts is already admitted by the lalt Congress, therefore it ought to be completed now ;we are juit told, too, that it was fully con sidered there. lafkrhen, Why was not the bnfinefs fully complered at that time—if it was not, then what good reason can be given for carrying it further now ?—ls there any new discovery of better rules to apportion by, or is the distress of the States who have yet some unaffumcd debt, as prefling as when they had to bear the burthen of three or four millions more than now ? Gentle men knew that the length thisbufinefs has gone already, has given great uneasiness to those States who made the grea eft exertions to extin gui(h their own debts, and to whose circumltan ces and feelings the resources applied to the as sumed debts of the States, are diflreifing and disagreeable. For what purpose are the commifijoners em ployed in adjusting the accounts between the in dividual States and the United States, if the whole of the State debts were to be afl'umed pre vious to that settlement ? We know the govern ment is not vested with powers to compel delin quent States to do justice, and that if ever justice is done to those States who have extinguished their own debt, it must be by iiicreafing of the general revenue in proportion to the money Congress will have to pay to those States, and it is an unjuflifiable and dangerous policy to draw the money from the people with the one hand, to pay ir to the state governments with theother. I have such information as 1 can depend upon, that the commissioners will report upon the final settlement of the State debts, in the-courfe of next winter ; and the resolution before the com mittee makes no provision for interefl until af ter the year 1792. Why then take this further leap in the dark, when those States who will be actually entitled to it, will be as soon relieved according to the principles of justice, as thev would be by diltributing the public property in this manner by rule of thumb. T always thought the afiumption of the State debts a meafnre which the constitution did not contemplate, and which had a tendency to sow the feeds of discontent in many parts of the Uni ted States, and now it is argued that the piece dent being set by the last Congress we ought to copy it :— 1 admit of no principles of infallibi lity in Congress—and if precedents produce an 1 obligation, we ought to be the more careful ncft to (trengthen them by repeating such as are im proper or doubtful. The only plausible reaf'ow for afluming the State debts in the last Congress so far, was to ease the burthen of such States as had been mod backward in providing for their refpedive debts, so as that they might be able to provide for what remained until I he accounts would be fettled, and to make some provision for the Srates who had done much to extinguish their debt as a security that the debts would be brought to a final settlement. Certainly tliofe Srates, at whose desire, and for wbofe conven ience so much has been done, ought to have a little more moderation. Mr. Madison observed, that a great deal had been laid to prove that the general government is under obligation to provide for the debts of the individual States : The gentlemen who maintain this opinion said he, have not shewn that the creditors themselves ever entertained an idea that they fliould look to the United States for payment of those debts ; it is not pre 442 i (ended that ilie new constitution varies the fit ß anon of . lie creditors-they It and precifel, " the lame ground they did under the old confe. deration. Mr. Madison denied that in"the for tner aflumption the creditors of the individnal States were considered in the fame point of light as the creditors of tile continent, and for the truth of this he appealed to thelaw itfelf " ma k ing provition for the public debt." The proposition now before the committee he confiderekl as unjust as it would place fume of the States which had made no exertions to ctif charge its debts, in a more eligible fi'uatiuu than those winch had made the greatelt exer tions to efFetft that objetft. He denied that the "rlt aflumption had been generally approved or had heen acquieiced in—and adverted to'the proceedings and resolutions of the State of Vir ginia on the fubjetft j papers (aid he, are on the table to (hew the truth of what is now aflerted • he added that he was sorry to find that 110 more attention had been paid to those papers. Mr Madison then noticed the slate of imports and ex ports from the several States, to ftiew the une qual operation of the aflumption as it affetfts those States, particularly Virginia,which pays f 0 great an overproportion of the interest on the debts of some of the States. Mr. Gerry stated a variety of instances to shew that the debts of the individual States were al ways considered as founded ultimately on the faith of the union ; that the creditors had ta ken the paper of the States on that idea—that the States were considered as agents for the Uni ted States—and on this principle the contracts for l'upplies and services on a continental ac count had been which the war must have ceased, and the subjugation of the United States have followed.—Mr. Gerry re marked on the partiality and evident injolticeof leaving the pofleflbrs of the remainder of the state debts totally unprovided for. The qneltion on agreeing to this proportion was carried in the affirmative this day, 5? to 2J but was eventually loft. LONDON, March 5. It isfaid the Lords will carry Mr. Haftings'sde fence into the country with them during the rc cefs, and think upon it at their Jeifure. Weflioitfd rather presume that they havefufliciently thought upon it already. Extrafl of a lett:r from Paris, "Jan. 26. " The prodigious and progreliive fall of the exchange 011 Prance in every commercial place in Europe, is but too true n consequence of the immense decay of credit, which mult e-ifue from the fort of chimerical government under which we live at present, in our way to the better fort of government we were promised by this afton idling revolution. —It will come no doubt ; but, in my opinion many eflential changes in thepre fent conftrudiion of the machine mull previonfly take place ; till then it will be the lotos the present generation to be totfed about on a very rough sea indeed. " Tlie relotn'ce of afTignats, which consider ing their excellent security, when used in mo deration, might have proved thefalvation of the country, finee they actually enabled the National Aflentbly to do at Jeaft one whole year without taxes, independent of the redemption of a great part of the debt ; those aflignats, I fay, have proved poison in the hands of the weak and the wicked ; for inflead of using them sparingly and temporarily as a gift from heaven, to fiin/h and fettle the conftitntion, they have leaned on then as on a very convenient pillow, and cared much less about reltoring proper force to government, which wai, however the only certain means of enforcing the payment of taxes. They go on digging into the mine till at la(t they find the quick ; they are not near it neverthelcfs, for the church land is worth fullchree milliards and an half [a milliard is iooo millions] equal to ip millions flerling, of which one milliard remains at illiie, besides the immense valueofthe forells, which, without injuring the interests of the navy, may yield perhaps twenty millions fterhng- What a country ! surely tlie moll exalted imagi nation could not bave wished for a richer foil for improvements and remedies of every kind, had they been but well husbanded." NOOTKA SOUND Many abfnrd reports having crept into the pi pers on the fubjec't of the indemnification to be given to thole gentlemen who fuffered by the capture of their (hips, it is neceflary to state the aiftual progress of this affair. The Spanish agent or Envoy, who is now here, had it in commiilion to enquire the amount o the damage follained, that is, the value of the ships, their cargoes, See. This was ftatefl at ijo,oool and this sum he is autliorifed to p*y- But the fufferers make another demand ; W " )C , is, tlie Aippofed profits that would have accme by the trade, for initance, carrying their furs to the China marker. The Envoy fays, he has no commission to allow any thing for this loss a" here the matter Hands for the juefent.
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