that the weds debts aid engagements, here expressed, would comprehend as well the rcfidue fttll due to the officers, soldiers, and other original creditors, as the claims of the present holders of alienated certificates ; and that if the constitution created any ob ligation concerning debts, &c. it had equal force with refpe£t to every description of creditors. But he apprehended that the con stitution did not, ,by the words expressed, place any debts allud ed to in a situation different from that in which they were previ ous to its adoption. Great stress, said he, had been 1 id upon the pra&ice of other nations. It had been frequently asserted, that the measure pro posed was without a precedent in any country : it had been re peatedly recommended to us to imitate the British parliament as to measures touching public credit. We howevei find, said he, a cause was cited yesterday, by an honorable member from Virginia (Mr. Madison) in which they made a provision as to debtors, similar to the one now under con fidcration. If precedent is therefore to influence, we have one from the nation whose public faith isextolled. But it had been ob served by an honorable member from New-York (Mr. LawranceJ that the precedent then cited was not applicable, because, said the gentleman, the British parliament and Congress are bodies very different as to power ; the former is omnipotent and unlimited as to objects of legislation ; the latter is not so, but reftn&ed and confined by the conffitution which controuls their power : That the British parliament can therefore do many a£ls confident with ♦heir powers, which Congress cannot. This observation, said Mr. Scncy, docs by no means diminish the force of the precedent ; because, although Congress possess not power as to all obje&s of legislation so extensive as the British parliament, yet, as to obje6ts •within their power, they were as much omnipotent as that parlia ment. It will not, he conceived, be denied, but that a provision refpefting public credit was one of those objects ; with regard, therefore, to the fubje£t under debate, there can be no difference between the two bodies as to omnipotence. It had been remarked, he said, by another member from New- York (Mr. Benfon) that the adoption of the amendment would be improper, because it was unsolicited by those whom it wa» de signed to benefit; and because there was reason to believe it would meet with difappiobation. The gentleman, he said, had informed us of a resolve of the Cin - cinnati of this State difavowingthe plan, and cited their proceed ings as evidence to prove this disapprobation. In replv to this, he would not then enquire how proper it would be for the commit tee, in their dccifion, to be influenced by any a& of the Cincin nati, or other focietv ; but believed, if the hiilory of the proceed ing alluded to was fully known,nothing could be inferred from it to effe£l that gentleman's purpose. That he had, since the pub lication of their refolVe. been informed, that the meeting of the society, at the time it pasTed, was not a full one ; that such a re solve was unexpe&ed by many until proposed, and that it pasTed •without debate, and, as it were, sub filcntio ; that he had since been informed that several of the body disapproved of the resolve, and believed that if a full meeting was had, a different determi nation wonld be the rcfult. He had conceived that the worthy members composing that body had too much experience of their own fufferings to be opposed to a provision in favor of those cre ditors for whom the compensation was intended, and could not think that such a provision would bedifapproved of by a society of the kind in any of the States. / It had, upon this occasion, been after ted, said he, that public opinion should have little influence on theconduft of legislatures. But, notwithstanding the plausible reasoning he had heard upon that head, he was fatisfied a regard was due and mufl be had to the opinions of the people, and to their feelings. Government, he said, was formed for their benefit ; under the prefentconftituti on, all the powers of it flow from them as the 4 fource ; they have the means of carrying into execution their will ; and under those circum fiances he could not believe the legislature ought to be in different as to their sentiments. Gentlemen, he said, had founded their opposition to the amend ment principally upon the rigid rules ftrittJv adhered to in the courts of common law ; rules which had often been the means of ftifiing justice, to corrett the rigour of which legislatures had often mterpofed. Such rules couli not be proper fetters for the su preme power of government. The history of Rations proves that Jegifldtures are superior to them ; their objc&s are extensive ; and m all extraordinary cases they will make luch provifiont as may be requisite to effett general justice and equity. The cafe under consideration was certainly one of an extraordinary kind. He could not think that those, whose exertions had rescued them and us from despotism and slavery, were ever honestly paid those tard-eafned claims they were I'o justly entitled to ; and could not but believe, that as long as those claims existed, there wonld exifl a stigma on the justice, humanity, and gratitude of this country. Mr. Livermore said he was against any discrimination between the soldier, or other public creditor, who held a public security, and the speculator who had purchased one. He said the securities were made payable to the bearer, and consequently transferable, intent that they might be fold, if convenience or nfceffity ftiould require if. This had been well understood by all parties, as well in America as in foreign countries, and securities had been fold accordingly. The advocates for discrimination have not de nied this ; they have only allcdged that the low rate at which the poor soldier, or other public creditor, had fold their securities, was a fufHcient reason for Congrefsto interfere and set aside the file. In opposition to this, Mr. Livermore observed, that per sons had a right to buy and fell at such prices as they could mutual ly agree upon, provided there was no fraud. A diamond, a horse, or a lot of ground, might be fold too cheap or too dear, and so might any other property ; but govern ment could not interfere without destroying the general system of law and justice. Esau had fold his birth-right for a mess of pot tage, and heaven and earth had confirmed the (ale. The distresses of the army, both officers and soldiers. at the time they received and fold their securities, had been painted in too strong a light. T hcv were not so emaciated, by sickness or famine, as had been represented. They were crowned with victory and received with applause by their fellow-citizens; and although they had been paid in'papcr,their loss had been made up by large bounties and m other emoluments, so that, in point of property, they were equal to their fellow-citizens, that had borne the burden of taxes, under "which many were laboring to this day. Let them be called brave fold iers. or pat riot 1 c soldiers, but not poor soldiers. They ought to be governed by the fame system of justice that go verns others ; but their contracts ought not to be fct aside out rtf partiality to them. He said the cafe quoted from the statute of Queen Ann, was not applicable to this cafe, inasmuch as govern ment had not originally made the debentures therein mentioned transferable. Neither, he said, did the cafe of the Canada bills apply ; for, as he understood, those bills were paid to Britilh merchants, or others, who had purchased them. Mr. Livermore concluded, by faying that he should vote a gainfl the araendmcn l , because no fufficient reason had been af (igned that could operate in his mind against the general system of right. (To be continued.) WEDNESDAY, MARCH 3. Mr. Arnfs of the committee to whom was recommitted the bill to provide for the rcmiflion or mitigation of fines, forfeitures and penalties in certain cases, presented a report, which was read On motion of Mr Lawrance the petition of Abraham Skinner, «vas read the fccond time—and referred to a committe of three. Mr. Sedgwick of the committee on the petition of Jehoiakim Mtochkfin brought in a report which dated, that the circumstan ces in the petition were fubflantiated—and proposed a resolve that the petitioner (hould be entitled to receive one hundred and twenty dollars out of the public Treasury, in full of his claims againfttke Uaitrd State*. Mi". Carrol afcer a few introductory observa tions shewing that several members wished fur ther time to digest the fnbjecl of the afl'umption of the State debts propofedthat the committee of the whole should be discharged from a further attention to that part of the Secretary's report for the prefent,and made a motion to that effe<ft, which was Seconded : This motion was objected to by Mr. Smith (S. C.) Mr. Lawrance and Mr. Sedgwick—and supported by Mr. Seney, Mr. White and Mr. Madison—the latter gentleman proposed an amendment, so that the committee should be discharged, till the Secretary of the Treasury should communicate the information ex pected from hiin on the fubjecft refpecfcing the re sources to be appropriated for the purpose of paying the debts to be afltimed : This motion was considered as an indirect method of getting rid of this particular part of the report altoge ther—and those who considered this part as in Separably conne&ed with all the reft observed, that if this was pafled over they should be totally at a loss how to aiflwith refpedt to the other obje&s of the report. It was further said that if this vote was adopt ed, it would place the State debts in a less eligi ble situation than those of the continental—when, as it was contended they ttood 011 equally merito rious sooting—these observations were concluded with a motion that the committee fliould suspend rhe confederation of the whole report, and not have reference to any particular part of it.—All idea of getting rid of the business as had been fuggelted, was disclaimed by Mr. Carrol—He thought the observation uncandid.—The differ ence between the Stare and continental creditors was urged by those who were in favor of the mo tion—and the acts of the old Congress to that purport, were cited—lt was said that no idea of opposition to this motion was expected, as the committee mull fee the propriety of waiting for the requisite information from the Secretary of the Treasury—The question on this motion be ing taken, was negatived. In committee of the whole on the natnraliza tion bill—the subject of admitting foreigners to the right of holding lands occasioned considera ble debate—it was urged that the power of form ing a uniform rule of naturalization is veiled in Congress by the constitution exclusively—and cannot reft in the States, without involving the greatest absurdity—as every State has its parti cular mode—from which every difficulty was experienced—lt is therefore neceflary that Con gress fliould determine upon a rule which fliould operate equally through all the States and gn to effecting complete citizenfhip.—ln reply to these observations it was said that the mode ofadmiffion to citizenship only, could be uniform ; that Con gress cannot interfere with the laws and regula tions of the several States—their power extends only to the rule, but the subsequent parts of ci tizenship must depend on the regulations of the respective States—when a foreigner is natural ized, he will immediately enquire what rights he becomes entitled to by virtue of his new charac ter —on motion Thefecond and third fedi'ions which related to foreigners holding lands were (truck out. The committee having proceeded through the discus sion, rose and reported the bill with amendments —and the House ordered the fame to be engros sed for a third reading.—Adjourned. THURSDAY, MARCH 4, Mr. Contee took his feat this day. The bill providing a uniform rule of na turalization, was brought in engrossed—read the third time, and pafled to be enatfted. The bill providing for the remission or mitiga tion of fines, forfeitures, and penalties, in certain cases, was read the second time, and referred to the committee of the whole house, to be taken up to morrow. Several petitions were read and committed In committee of the whole on the bill to pro mote the progress of the ufeful arts. The bill was read, and difcufled in paragraphs. The clause which gives a party a right to appeal to a jury from the ilecifion of referees, it was moved, fliould be struck out. This motion was opposed, as depriving the citizen of a right to which he is entitled—as improper in itfelf, as causes of very great magnitude may be depending, which it may be highly improper to submit to the decision of three men only, two of which may be so different ly interested, as never to agree—so that the deci sion may finally result from the influence of the pei foil nominated by the Secretary of State. On the other hand it wasfaid, that it appears highly improper that juries should be called tojudge up on matters that they may not be supposed com petent to forming a judgment os—these trials will always relate to matters of invention, &c. of which three persons may be found with much greater ease who are competent to judge, than twel-e—that the right of trial by juries' is not universal—and in the present cafe there will be a much greater probability of having jus tice done by arbitrators, who are men offcience &c. The motion for linking cut was carried in the affirmative. 374 The committee proceeded further in the dis cussion of this bill—but rose without compleatine it—and the chairman reported progress. A report was received from the Secretary of theTreafury, pursuant to orders from the House and read. ' FRIDAY, MARCH j Mr. Foflerof the committee on the memorials of the people called quakers ref'peciing the slave trade brought in a report, which was read. Mr. Gerry presented a petition from Catha rine Greene relidl of the late Major General Greene—which was read. Mr. Scot moved that the memorial of Richard Wells and J. Hart refpe<fting the old paper mo ney, ffiould be referred to the committee of the whole House. The question being taken the motion was ne gatived—it was then moved that it be referred to a feledt committee often members—which pas. fed in the affirmative. A memorial was presented by Mr. Tucker from the officers of the Soutli-Carolina line of the late army. In committee of the whole <>n the bill for the remission, or mitigation of fines, penalties and forfeitures in certain cases—the bill was read and having made one amendment the committee rose, and reported the lame to the House, who ordered the bill to be eugroffed for a third read- ing. In committee of the whole on the hill to pro mote the progress of the ufeful arts—Sundry a mendments were made in this bill, which were reported to the House, these amendments with several others were agreed to, and incorporated in the bill, which was ordered to be engrofledfor a third reading on Monday next. A meflage from the Senate informing that they have pafledan acfl to accept of the cession of cer tain lands in the Western Teiritory, made by the State of North Carolina—Alfo,that they have palled arefolve, forgiving further inftru<ftjons to the colletftors of import in the United States, in which they request the concurrence of the Honfe. The bill to provide for the reiniffion, or mi tigation of fines, forfeitures and penalties was brought in,engrofled, read the third time,aador derea to lie on the table. The a<fl aod resolve received from the Senate were then read. The petition of Mrs. Greene was read a fecotfd time, and referred to a committee of five. The report of the committee on the letter from the commissioners on accounts, refpe<fiing the sa laries of the Clerks in their office was read---A motion for recommitting this report, and inftruft ing the conimitte to bring in a bill pursuant there to, occasioned considerable debate refpecfting the difference between a resolve and a law—the mo tion for recommitting pafled in the affirmative— the fubjeft of the south western frontiers being moved for—the galleries were shut. Adjourned till Monday. li Treasury Department, March 4, 1790. In obedience to the Order of the Houfc of Representatives, of the second injl. The Secretary of the Treasury refpeftfutly reports, THAT in his opinion, the fundsin the nrft instance requisite to wards the payment of interest on the debts of the individual States, according to the modifications pmpofed by him in his report of the ninth of January past, may be obtained from the following ob jects : An increase of the general produtt of the duties on goods im ported, bv abolishing the discount of ten per cent, allowed by the fifth feftion of the A6l for laying a duty on goods, wares, and mer chandize, imported into the United States, in refpett to goods im ported in American bottoms, and adding ten percent, to the rates fpecified, in refpett to goods imported in foreign bottoms, with certain exceptions and t qualifications : This change, without im pairing the commercial policy of the regulation, or making an in convenient addition to the general rates of the duties, will occasion an augmentation of the revenue little short of two hundred thou sand dollars. An additional duty on imported sugars. Sugars arc an objett of general csnfumption : and yet constitute a small proportion of the expence of families. A moderate addition to the present rates would not be felt. From the bulkinefs of the article too, such an addition may be made with due regard to tfce fafety of collcftion. The quantity of brown and other inferior kinds of sugar import ed, appears to exceed twenty-two millions of pounds, which at a half cent per pound, would produce one hundred dnd ten thou sand dollars. Proportional impositions on foreign refined iugar, nnd proper diawbacks on exportation, ought of courfc to indem nify the manufacturers of this article among ourselves. MolafTes, being in some of the States a substitute for sugar, a small addition to the duty on that article, ought to accompany an increase of the duty on sugar. This, however ought to be re gulated with proper attention to the circumflance, that the fame article will contribute largely in the fliape of distilled spirits. Half a cent per gallon on molafle«, would yield an annual sum of thirty thousand dollars. Our distillers of spirits from this mate rial, may be compensated, by a proportional extenfionof thedu ty on imported spirits. Snuff, and other manufactured tobacco, made within the Uni ted States : Ten cents per pound on the Snuff, and fix cents on other kinds of manufactured tobacco, would be likely to produce annually, from ninety to one hundred thousand dollars. From as good evidence as the nature of the cafe will admit, the quan tity of these articles manufactured in the United States, may be computed to exceed a milion and a half of pounds. The impo sition of this duty would require an increase of the duty on im portation, and a drawback on exportation, in favor of the manu facture. Thi* being an absolute fuperfluity, is the faireft objeCt of revenue that can be imagined, and maybe so regulated, as in n« degree, to injury either the growth, or manufacture of the com modity Pepper, pimento, spices in general, and various other kinds of groceries. Thrfe articles will bear such additional rates, as may be eft i mated to yield a sum of not less than thirty thousand dollars.
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