CONGRESS.
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
SATURDAY Dec. n.
(Debate concluded from oar 'ufl.)
Mr. Seney said he could not conceive what
groundof a'pprehenfion there was in the addrsft,
to lead gentlemen to suppose that the opinion of
the house would be committed by its adoption—
He thought it couched in the molt general and
unexceptionable terms: The amendment pro
pofed,he didaiot think vary'd eflentially from the
paragraph under consideration—but as the ori
ginarwas well exprefltid, he law no reason for ex
punging theclaufe—it contained an aflertion,the
truth of which he fuppafed would not be contro
verted. As to the objection against going into-a
detail of particulars, it was fully jultiried by pre
cedent in the last address—-the gentleman from
South Carolina, if his memory served hiin, was
on the committee who framed it—that address
more pointedly committed the house than the
j>r*feut.
Mr. Madison thought proper to take some no
ace of the objection , that had been niaile to the
report. There were two modes of proceeding,
he said, that might be adopted in drawing up the
answer. The firft method was generally to de
clare, that the House would take into their seri
ous coniideration the business recommended to
their attention by the President : And this, he
observed, would be faying nothing, for as by the
constitution it was the Frefident's duty to eom
mimicate what matters he judged of importance;
so it was undoubtedly that of the house to pay at
tention to the objects recommended. The,fecond
method was, to enter into a detail of the different
points mentioned in the President's address, and
in fucli cases where there was no doubt as to the
propriety of measures' being taken, allure him in
the answer, that measures would be adopted ;
and if any thing doubtful occurred, merely pro
mise that the fubjedt should be attended to. This
rule the committee had followed in drawing up
their report, and as in the business mentioned in
the paragraph now before the house, they did not
hesitate to believe some measures neceflkry, they
could fee no impropriety in afTuring him that the
best would be adopted. He added, that as it is
clear that a war in Europe would by depriving us
of foreign bottoms to export our produce, injure
this country ; and as wars were doubtful, it was
of the utmost importance that the American navy
be put on so refpe<flable a footing as not to need for
eign aid for the exportation of jher produce. He
further obferved,that the answer returned laflfef
fion, was more full, and went even to give the
President afliirances that the house would concur
in certain points proposed for their consideration
111 his address. He concluded by remarking, that
the amendment proposed was binding 011 the
House quite as much as the paragraph in the
report.
Mr. Bmith said it wa? true those who reported the addrtfs the
last feflion, adverted to particulars, but were cautious in their
mode of expreflion, and adopted ambiguous language to avoid
giving an opinion : This would appear by recurring to that ad
drefr : The charge of mconfiftenuy on his pari, was therefore not
•well founded. Mr. Smith read foine paragraphs of that address,
and obTeived, that the houfc was not pledged by the expressions
then read ; but in the present address, there is an opinion given :
It fays that we ought not to depend on foreign bottoms* because
in cafe of war we may be deprived of that resource. These de
clarations originate the obje&ions, and gave rife to the proposed
amendment. He proposed therefore, as gentlemen appear to have
no objo&ion to either mode of expreflion,that they would accom
modate for the fake of haimony and unanimity.
WEDNESDAY, Dec. ij, 1790.
IT should have been mentioned in our last that
Mr. Ranfellaer took his l'eat on Tuesday.
A petition from A. E. Lutterloh wasprefented
by Mr Bloodworth, which was read and laid 011
the table.
Mr. Lawrance presented the petition of Timo
thy Mix—refered to the Secretary at War.
Mr. Fitzfimons presented the petition of Tho
jnas Randal!—read and refered to the Secretary
of the Treafury.—Alfothe petition of John Linn,
<—referred to theSecretaiy at War.
The motion laid on the table by Mr. Smith,
rtfpecting the Enlogium on Dr. Franklin, was
called for by that gentleman and parted.
Mr. Ames presented the petition of Jofiali
Simpfon, in behalf of sundry persons who had
performed services as blacksmiths, for which they
have not received due compenfatian—read and
refered to the Secretary at War.
Mr. Gerry presented the petitions of Reuben
Gold and Amos Davis refered to the Secretary
at War.
Mr. Burke presented the memorial of
which was read and rcfered to the Se
cretary of the Treasury.
Mr. Jackson moved that leave be given tobriiig
in a bill to continue an adt, declaring the aflent
of Congress to certain atfts of the State of Rhode
Island, Maryland a»d Georgia, which will expire
the 10th dayofjannary next.
A Committee was accordingly appointed con
| lifting of Mefl'rs. Jackson, Ames and Stu.ges.
On motion oflir. Smith, (S. C.) the HouSe
resolved itfelf int« a committee of the whole,
(Mr. Livermore ii the chair) and took into con
sideration the Speech of the President of the Unit
ed States, to both Houses of Congress. Ihe
Speech was read by the Clerk—after which Mi.
Smith (S. C.) recapitulated the several lubjec r ts
Specially Suggefled to the Consideration of the
House, by "the Speech; he diftingui/hed Such
parts of the Speech as were already in train, by
being reSered the lall Selfion to heads of depart
ments, and others which have been refered to
committees ; and then moved a reSolotion with
a blank to be filled up with Such articles as are
not already particularly provided for, iby being
refered or committed.
Mr. Boudinot was in favor of chufing a com
mittee to confer with the Senate on the mode of
taking up the several parts of the speech.
Mr. Vining was in favor of Mr. Smith's moti
on.
Mr. Lawrance said that it appeared to him
that tlie usual mode of conlulering the speech,
would be the bed ; he therefore thought it pro
per that it lhould be taken up 111 paragraphs —
and where it appeared that particular parts were
already difpol'ed of, to let them be palled over;
and with refpetft"to others, committees might be
appoinred, as the committee of the whole may
determine.
Mr. Clymer fujpofed, that agreeable to the de
termination o£ ths House lsut leltion, the whole
business lhould betaken up dt novo.
TheChairinanobferved that ds the whole speech
was now before the Committee, it remained to
proceed to the d.fcuflion of the several parts —
pursuant to which he Ihould read it paragraph by
paragraph, and the committee Would determine
refpetfting them, as they saw proper—this appear
ed to him to be. the natural way of doing the bu
siness.
Mr. Vining said the difficulty appeared to ori
ginate in the mode—for his part, he thought the
Jeaft circumlocutory the best, and for that rea
son had fecoudeJ the motion by the gentleman
from South Carolina.
The motion of Mr. Smith lay on the table—and
the Chairman to read the speech in
paragraphs.—On reading the paragraph refpect
ingthe Indian expedition, Mr. Smith moved that
the article Should be inserted in the blank in his
motion.
Mr. Lawrance supposed it best to pass over this
article.
Mr. Vii\ing concurred in the sentiment with
Mr. Lawrance.
Mr. Hartley was opposed to paflingthis matter
over—the profpedt that further hol'tilitics would
take place between the inhabitants of the fron
tiers and the Indians rendered it highly neceflary
that something fhouldbe done iinnicdiaiely.
Mr. Seney said he had m> idea that any gentle
man in the committee had it in view to pass over
this business entirely—Hill he thought it impossible
to determine at once whaa is proper to be done 011
every fubjed't—The mode proposed by the gentle
man from South Carolina.appeared to him calcula
ted to commit thejudgment of the House.
Mr. Lee obferved,that as the committee as fuel),
had no right to appoint a committee ofany kind,
he thought that any thing further than expref
hng the sense of the committee on the several
pans of thefpeech, would be improper ; with this
vi?w he submitted a resolution to the following
effect, on the paragraph respecting Indian affairs,
viz. Resolved, that it is the opinion of the com
mittee that the present posture of Indian affairs,
requires the lerious attention oi the legislature.
This was seconded by Mr. Seney.
Mr. Smith obje&ed to this motion as it did not
bring the object fully before the committee : If
the gentleman would consent that it fliouhl go
so far as to propose the appointment of a select
committee, he should have no objection to it.
Mr. Lee supported his motion.
Mr. Lawrance observed that it appeared to him
that nothing more wasneceffary to be done in this
business, than providing the means of defraying
the expence—-he had supposed it would Jtrike
the committee in this point of light—The expe
diency or inexpediency of the expedition he pre
sumed was not now to be difcufled—The President
does not appeal to the house to determine the
propriety of his conduct—The expedition lias
been approved of by the house in their anfwerto
the President's speech—He therefore moved the
following, Resolved, as the sense of this commit
tee that immediate proviiion ought to be made to
defray the expences ofthe expedition ajrainft the
Indians, N. W. of the Ohio.
Mr. Lee withdrew his motion—and that of Mr.
Lawrance being put was agreed to.
The paragraph refpecfting our navigation being
lead, Mr. Goodhue observed, that the reason as
674
signed by the gentleman from S. Carolina, for
palling over ciiac part of the Prelident's speech,
that this fubjetf: was connected with the lilheries
on which a report from the Secretary of the i rea
fury, was expe<fted, did not appear fulficient to
himtojuftify thetr palfing it over—He therefore
moved thelollowing, Rtjolvcd, as the lenle ot this
committee, that a committee ought to be appoint
ed to bring in a bill for the further encourage
ment of the navigation of the United States.
Mr. Smith, obierved that he thought tliefub
ject was refered to the Secretary ot State—He
read a paragraph from the speech to fliew it was
connected with the fiiheries. He wifhedlforafuf
penfion of tiie buiin'efs, as the exact ftateofaffairs.
in Europe <vas at present unknown.
Mr. Fitzfimons laid that the reasons offered
were fuliicient to prevent al'uddon decilion—but
did not in his opinion render it improper to rake
up the fubjec r t immediately—He should be op
posed to an ultimate decilion till the fullelt in
formation is obtained.
Mr. Vining eiuered into a general considera
tion of the subject ; lie thought the present the
critical moment in which this interesting bnfinels
(hould be difculled on its own proper principles j
he thought tliepropofed resolution did not enter
fully en«ugh into the merits of the fubjec f t, agree
able to the ideas fuggelted by the Prefid'ent ; he
therefore proposed a resolution which went to
express the femiments of the house refpeiting
making provision for the transportation of Ame
rican produce, in American bottoms.
Mr. Goodhue objected to the motion of Mr.
Vining at the present moment, though he fully
accorded with him in principle, he tho'ughr the
motion he had submitted would more generally
meet the present ideas of the committee.
Mr. Jackson opposed Mr. Vining's motion ; he
said though he was ajrainlt taking any measures
atprefent, he preferred the relolution of the
gentleman from Salem
O
Mr. Viuing withdrew liis motion.
Mr. Goodhue's motion being put, pafled in the.
affirmative.
.The paragraph refpe&ing the Mediteranean
trade being read—Mr. Smith moved the follow
ing. Resolved, that fiich part of the Prefldent's
speech as relates to the trade to the Mediteranean,
be referred to the Secretary of State ; agreed to.
On the fiibjects of weights and measures, Mr.
Vining moved the following. Resolved, as the
sense of this committee, that a committee ought
to be appointed to bring in a bill or bills pro
viding for the.cilablilhment of a uniform lland
ard of weights and measures throoghout th«" Uni
ted States.
Mr. Boucllnot suggested the propriety of pall
ing over this business at present ; he mentioned
a reaion offered by the Secretary of State, that
there was to be a convention in Europe on this
particular business ; the result of ihe meeting is
not yet known.
Mr. Law ranee proposed that as the report of
the Secretary of the Treafut y had not been a<ft
ed upon, that it should now be refered to * com
mittee of the whole house.
Mr. Vining observed that if that report was
tobedifcufled by the house, they mult divest
themselves of the cliafaifter of politicians and as
sume that of philosophers ; the discussion he con
ceived would employ the committee till next
March, 12 months. He thought the mode he pro
posed would be found more Ample, and the com
mute appointed would naturally avail themselves
of the Secretary's report.
Mr. (S. C.) was in favor of taking up the Se
cretary's report in committee of the whoje.
Several members spake against Mr. Vining's
motion, which being put, was loft.
The discussion being gone through, the com
mute rose and reported the resolutions they had
agreed to which being read, are as follows :
Refolded, as the opinion of this committee, that
immediate proviiion be made to detray the ex
penses of the expedition against the Indians,
North Weft of the Ohio ; this resolution was
agreed to, and referred to the Secretary of the
Treasury.
Resolved, as the-fenfe of this committee, that
a coinmitte ought to be appointed to bring in a
bill or bills making further provision for the en
couragement of the navigation of the United
States ; agreed to by the house, and referred to
a committee of twelve.
Resolved, that such parts of the Prefident'ft
speech as refers to the Mediterranean trade, be
referred to the Secretary of State.
On motion of Mr. Boudinot it was resolved,
that the report of the Secretary of the Treasury
on the fubjecliof the unappropriated lands—and
the inilitutinga land office, be referred to a com
mittee of the whole house on Friday next.
Oidered, That one hundred copies be printed,
for the uie of the house.
On motion of Mr. Smith* (S. C.) the report of
the Secretary of State 011 the fubied: of Weights
and Measures, was referred to the committee oi
the whole house on Wednelday next.
Adjourned.