[No. XLIV.] For The Tablet, No. XLIV, fee /ast page. NEW-YORK, September 12, 1789. SKETCH OF PROCEEDINGS OF CONGRESS. In the HOUSE of REPRESENTATIVES of the UNITED STATES, THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 3. Viite mthcfdjcß tf fixing the PERMANENT SEAT of GOV ERNMENT—Continued. THE motion of Mr. Goodhue being read, Mr. Madison observed, that as thegentleman has been candid enough to inform the committee that theu measures have been preconcerted, and that the better half of the Union are to be difpofcd of by con tract at the {Sovereign will of the other, I hope they will be also io candid as to Ihew in the clearest manner, that the principles which have now been established are applicable to the motion made by the Member from Maflachufetts. I wifti they would prove that the place which they have pitched upon, is in fa£t the permanent center, and New-York the temporary center of wealth, population and extent of territory, that the grounds may be known on which this great qucftion is to be dccided. Mr. Goodhue replied that the Sufquehanna is not far from the center of territory ; that itis further south than the center of population, which may fall fomewhereon the Delaware. I believe that this center of population will never alter materially, as I sup pose it will always incline towards the manufa&uring States. Mr. JaPkson I was originally opposed to the question's com ingforward, and am so flill. I thought the fubjett ought not to be touched upon till the States who have not yet acceded io the Union might have an opportunity of giving their voice ; I agree with the gentleman from Virginia. lam sorry that people Ihould learn that th : s matter has been precipitated ; that they (hould learn that the Members from New-England and New-York had fixed on a feat of government for the United Slates. This is not proper language to go out to freemen. Jealousies have already gone abroad. This language will blow the coals of sedition anti endanger the Union. I would ask if the other members of the Union are not also to be consulted ? Are the taftern members to dictate in this business, and fix the feat of government of tbe United States ? Why not also fix the principles of government ? Why not come forward and demand of us the power of legiflatior, and fay, give us up your privileges, and we will govern for vou ? If one part has the power to fix the feat of government, they mzy as well take the government from the other-—This looks like ari stocracy. Not the United, but the partial voice of America is codccide—how can .gentlemen answer for this, who call t.bem- Xclves Representatives on the broad basis of national interest ? I deny the fa& oi the territorial centrality of the place propof td. From New-York to the nearest part of theprovince ot Maine, it is two hundred and fifty miles ; and from New-York to the nearest part of the upper diftriffc of Georgia, from which my Col- Itague, General Matthews comes is eleven hundred miles ; and from the proposed place on Sufjquehannah, it is four hundred miles to the nearest part of Maine, and qco to the nearaft part of that diftrift.—The proportion is more than four to one. But the gentleman should have an eye to the population of Georgia. One of the fined countries in the worlA cau not but rapidly extend her population. Nothing but her being harraffed Dy the inroads of hajchecked her amazing increase, which must under the of peace and fafety people her western regions.—Georgia will soon be as populous as any State in the Union. Calculations ought hot to be mad eon its present situation. He concluded with himfelf in favor of the Patowmae. Mr. Goodhue replied that the diflance from that partofthe province of Maine, from which one of his Colleagues came, to Sufouehannah is seven hundredandfixty miles;from Savannah, to the fame center about seven hundred ; and from Kentucky nearly the fame. Mr. Laur ance observed, that when this matter was under dif cuflion feme time, it appeared to be the wilh of the members from the eaftwajd, and of the Representation from this State, that this cili should not now be decided. TKey urged ieveral reasons vto U would be improper. I xho.ughl those relfofns weighty, and poflponing the consideration till next meeting : But it was jnfwcred that the business was important; that the citizens of the tnrtcd-States were uneasy andanxirtils, that factions-did not now **iil, : and Chat k was now the pct>per time to decide tins qtitflion. the Representation from the eastward to do ? Was ft Wt neceflary tor them to con Cult, and fix upofi the proper place ? They are disinterested. It is well known, he said, that gov ernment is expected to be "fixed in Virginia, Maryland, Penn sylvania, or Jerffcy. We are called on to determine on a question w whigh we conceive ourselves unbialTed, and to detertnirfe it on principles wjiich wil) rcfleft honor on th»s House. I trust it wi'lbe found that we have fixed on those principles, and that this resolution ivill be confirmed by Congrcfs. do not, he said, decide for the Union, nor for the southern States. We decidc •or QHtfelVej, arid if our .reakms are substantial, I trust that gen ticineu-wiU meet us in the 4vteripinasiQo. There are Several which have been agreed to in the general refo'likion. I believe it will be {hewn with exattnefs, 'hat the place prop<Mc*tl will come within principles. The tutpopulation. Isihe Houlie tocoqfider the present or the <Xpe£icd population ! The rcfolutioii has a determinate meaning : lpeaks ;h r e Bt tjbe present period : and to calcu ljte on this principle, gentlemen can not fay *is unjust. The Rt> P'tfeMetipn in this House is itfdf a demonstration of it. The fopulatiou vof this country may be determined pretty fafelv by • e pioporno:i in thgrlloufe ; for k is probable that it iveftablifhod on this ground. 1 believe therefore that the principle-os popuJa 'ontcadsto this place in preference to a more southern fituatioij. But to take up the principle of territory, are the House to caL on the uninhabited w.ildernefs ? Shall they takethe Lake J the Wcods on ont fide, and the Miflouri an the othor, and nd a-gcogiaphical center ? Iffo, to what an extent must tiiey V .populated part of the country ought 10 considered. I-f St. Croix is taken as thjs eastern limit, , f Mar y a * southern, the conter of tht l*ne will be found ooh pretty the Sufquehanna. it is another important confederation that this center is cn navi- f a snd fufficientlw removed from the Atlanticcoaft, '\Vet a ' as to security. With refpeft to the e u-m Country, its situation is convenient favorable, with 2n°'^ muw ! caiK)n k»»d and and easy. But thi° l ? r^n< *^P^ e ihould be attended to. It been bintt'd that ought not to govern; but 1 think it of .fom.e importance. jJ. [« mca ,ou ld look to those part's of t'he.country where is the ,5* portion, the c-omtnercial and opulant cities, ilhd fee 11 r , e \\»ealth,thc ftrcngth the Union, nwails-b<y lie iU ted State.*- are tojic pi:ote£»ed, and tfce sources from foiw ■^|? vernincnt tod raw its principal fiqjports. It will be i,- /ut r c ofthefe is the 'uorther.ii and casern States, wc 1J » Member*had: confuted their o\v.n intercfts, they u J 'c cliofcn the banks of the Delaware ; but they |knew it SATURDAY, September 12, 1739. would not be deciding oo those generous principles, which might e expected. They knew that there is one State not yet in the Union, to which fueh a measure would givedifgujt. r. Sedgwick asked if there was really any impropriety in gent emen s consulting together, who had a uniformity of interests upon a queltion, which it had beenfaid, was so infinitely impor tant. My colleague, said he, has barely stated that such a con u tat ion iias taken place, and that in consequence of it, men's ni have been induced to run in a current. Is there any thing wrong in this ? Let those who are determined not to consult nor ave any communication on luch a fubjeft, determine for them ( v es. I should think myfelf loft, to that regard which I owe to 3n< * ' mm? diate constituents in particular, should I a rtract myfelf from the contemplation ofthebenetits which would low from knowing the feelings and sentiments of those with whom lam to act. Instead of being an evidence of that aristo cratic spirit which has been mentioned, it is only a proof that men, attentive to their business had preferred that way, which C r u*°ri . m3n have had in view. I have contemplated t lelubjecl with great anxiety, and though I can not declare that my loca4 situation has had no influence on rny mind, yet I will-fay I endeavored that it-should have none. I believe that die trite interests of the country will be beil answered by taking a pofrtion ealtward and northward of the Sufquehanna. The, Delaware is one extreme, the Patowmac another. But when I rcfleft how anxious forue gentlemen are foror\e, and Come -for the -another. I am willing io accommodate by advancing to a middle ground, to which I hope the public mind will be reconciled. I-n fixing this opinion I was alto influenced by the sentiment of the celebrated Montcfquieu. He has laid it down that in a country partaking of northern and fuuthem interests, of a poor and a produ&ive foil, the center and the influence of government ought to incline to that part where the former circumflanoes prevailed ; beca.ufe ne ceftity stimulates to industry, produces habits and a fu,r.plus of labour ; because such parts are the nurseries of soldiers and fail oips, and the fourcesot that energy which is the best security of the government. The Sufquehanna in my opinion is southwest of the center of wealth, population and resources of every kind. I would sug gest another idea. In my view, on the principles of population, the Sufquehanna is far beyond the center; for I do not think it just on this fubjett to take the constitutional computation. Will any gentleman pretend that men who are merely the fubjeft of property or wealth should be taken into the eftirnate, that the slaves of the country, men, who have no rights to prote&, being deprived of them all, fhotild be taken into view in determining the center of government ? If they are considered, gentlemen may as well estimate the black cattle of New-England. I would aik if it U of no importance to take a position in which the credit ofthe government may procure those fupplics, that its neccflities require. Will the strength and riches of the country be to the iMrth or to the south of the Sufquehanna ? Cer taiuly to the uorth. It is an opinion of all the eastern States, that the climoXe of Pa towmac, is not only unhealthy but deftru&ive to northern con stitutions. Itrs of importance to attend to this: for let the thing be true or falfir, rfiich is the public prepoffeflion. Vast numbers of ea&ern adventurers have gone to the iouthcrn States, and all have found their graves there. They have met dc&ru&ion asfoon as they aYrived. These accounts have been spread, and .filled the northern people with apprehension. With regard to the temporary residence, I originally had very little concern where it (hould be, but I believe that it the govern ment should take a temporary Hand so central as Philadelphia, so seducing would be the accommodations of that city, and foftrong the interefl of that powerful State, that it would be more difficult to remove Congreis ever from it, than from a place which is ac knowledged to be improper for their permanent feat. Mr. Viking observed, that he muil acknowledge himfqlfa p-rty to the bargain, though he had no share in making it. It is, said he, an Unexpe&ed bargain to me, though it involves the in terests ofthe State which I represent. lam yet to learn whether Congress arc to tickje the trout in the stream of the Codorus, to build their sumptuous palaces on the banks of the Patowmac, 3r to admire commerce, with her expanded wings on the waters jf the Delaware. I have on tliis occasion educated my mind to impartiality, and have chastised its prejudices. I copfefs to the House and to the world, that viewing this fub jt£l with all its ckcumAances, i am in favor ®f the Patowmac. I wish the feat olf government to be fixed there, because I think the intercft. the honor, and the greatness of this country require it. I look on it as the center from which those streams are to flow, that are to animate-and invigorate the body politic. From thence it appears to me the rays of government will most natural ly diverge to the extremities of the Union. I declare that I look on the Western Territory in an awful and striking point of view. To that region the unpo'lifhed sons of the earth are flocking from all quarters. Men to whom the prote&ion of the laws and the corttrouling force of the government arc equally neceflary from this great consideration I conclude that the banks of the Patowmac are the proper station. With refpeft to the temporary residence. The accommoda tions which have been fnentioned operate as retffons against New- York. It is indeed but too agreeable; its allurements are too dan gerous ; when I look round I fee such handfomp arguments addres sed to my feelings that my underflanding dreads their imprcflion. Mr. Lee moved to flr.ike out the words " ea-ft bank of the Suf quehanna" and to insert a clause to this effect, That whereas the banks of the Patowmac united all the aforefaid advantages with fertility of foil, salubrity of climate, &c. Resolved that the per manent feat of government ougltf to be fixed some where on the banks ofthe said river. He then stated at large the comparative advantages of Patow itiac, its great and increaling improvements, the extent of its navi gation, its direst communication with the WefternCountry,and its eaTy communication with the Eastern and Southern States. The house, he said, are now to determine whether regard is to he had to a central position—whether regard is to be had to the people o.f the Western Territory, to the greater portion of the ter ritory of the Union : In point of climate, it is extremely falubru ous, in fertility it is exceeded by no country on earth. Thither will emigrants from all quarters flock. I afk-if this government is intended for a temporary or a lasting one ; whethar it is to be a fleeting -vision, or to continue for ages ? I hppe that the result will proclaim that the government iscalcula ted for perpetuity, and that the common interests of the country have been consulted. If that is done, the government will be le movedto the Patowmac ; if not, we shall stop short of it ; and what will be the confcquenGe ? I am averse to found alarms, or introduce terrors into theihoufe ;ibut if they are well founded, I think it my duty. It is well known with what difficulty the Copftitution was adopted by the .State of Virginia. It was then -feid that there would be corffederacie9 of the States East of Penn sylvania* which would deftrov the Southern States. That they would unite their councils in difcufling questions relative to their particular interests, and the Southern States would be tUfregarded. To these suspicions it was answered, no ! It was contended that the magnanimous policy arising from mutual interests 2nd com \_PitbliJbed (jti Wediiefday arid Saturday .J mon dangers would unite all the States, and make them pursue objcfts of general good. But if U Ihould be found that there are such confederacies as were predicted, that the Northern States do consult their partial interests, and form combinations to fuppoit them, without regarding their South ren brethren, they will be a larmed, and the faith of all south of the Patowmac will be shaken. It will be (hewn.to them, that what was predicted by the enemies to the Constitution has come to pass, that the Northern States liave not even waited till the Government was organized, but arc facri ficing the Southern people to their own interests. Let the feat be fixed where it will, Virginia has not fol.icited Congress to place its feet in her State. She only contends that the interests of the Southern and Western country Ihould be consult ed. And I declare, that these interests will be facrificed if Con £refs fixes on any place but the Patowrriac. The greater part of Virginia is distant from that river. Man-y parts are not nearer than New-Jei fey. She wishes not co have the feat on the Patow mac but for the general good. It is not for the benefit of that State, but the Union. Mr. Laurance said it is improper and imneceffary to hold out terrors to the fancy of members. The true way to convince them is to address their understanding, 1 -am fnr« there is no danger ous confederacy which the gentleman has talked of. I believe that the conduct of the .Northern States will bear the striCtest scru tiny; that if probed to the bottom it,will be found fair and candid. I remember in the debate upon the tonnage bill a gentleman from Virginia observed that could the moderate and equal policy pfthat day's proceeding have been forefeen in the Convention of Virgin ia, it would have obviated many objections that were there pro duced againit the Constitution. In conducting the bulinefs before us, I trufl. that gentlemen will find no cause eventually to entertain different fentiraents from what he then delivered. Mr. Madison: I admit that oft a former occasion I applied the remark quoted by the gentleman from New-York ; but I now as veTily believe, that had a Prophet darted up in that Convention, and foretold the proceedings of this day, Virginia would not now be a party to this Constitution. A motion being made for riling. Mr. SiDcwieK : I hope the committee will not rife. Will it be contended, that the majority shall not govern; and (hall the minority because they cast not carry their points, accuse the House of want of candor ? Are we to be told that an important State would not have joined the Union had they known what would have been the proceedings of this House. Gentlemen have brought forward this business themselves : They have precipitated the House into it. We prayed, said he, We supplicated for time ; and now gentlemen from some causes not explained, wish to postpone the matter, in order to have time to deliberate. I believe that a deliberation of fix weeks would not alter airngle opinion, and it is not proper to consume the public timeofelefsly. Mr. Mao;isjon contended for a poftponernem a* a right. De bate ought not to be precluded, said he. The minority certainly are to be governed bj the majority, butthey claim a right to bring forward all those fads and arguments which can have a*iy poflible influence. It is unuiual to pcefjs for a decision an occasions like these, after a partial diCotiliioii of a Tingle day. Questions of less magnitude has occupied weeks. This business prefects an afpeCk ; it marks a genius in this body, which will cootradiCt the expecta tions of its warmest friend*. I wiftx to make many observations for whiph there is not now an opportunity. I wish to fpeaJc to gentlemen who wiU open their ears ; and nottp Client majorities, who bear down every thing before them. I hope another day to experience a cooler and more favorable temper. Mr. Ames : I remember, said he, that when this futijeCt cac>e before the House the other day, when we solicited for delay, it was observed that she neceflities of the Union required an imme diate decision—that it would take up but little time—that the pro per centre might be easily ascertained—that this would depend on geographical calculation, and that little dircuflion would be ne cessary. Now, when circumstances appeaTto be changed—when the calculation is made—when the House are ready to vote, gen tlemen come forward and pretend that they want time. I hope the queftiou will be now decided. While I am up I would ob feive that I do not entertain a doubt of the patriotism and good intention® of the gentlemen from Virginia. I believe however, that their judgments are influenced by tbeir wilhes, for they fee«n to be engaged with a degree of eagtrnefs whith none else appear to feel. The very language of their motion declares this. They seem to think the banks of Patowto&c a paradise, and that iiver a Euphrates. I have been told it is a fine spot—and I (interely *rifh those bleflings may ever reside there. Mr. Burke : The Northern States have had a fortnight to ma nage this matter, and will .not now allow the Southern a day. What is the conduCt of gentlemen ? A league has been formed between the Northern States and Pennsylvania. [Here Mr. FitE firaons contradicted him.} This morning furnimed the firft in formation of it. 1 want information. I call on gentlemen for the honor of the House to give more time. The qucftion pn rising was carried. Friday, September 4. Mr. ScOtt, being called on, said, he had no to give his sentiments. The refolvfc which I laid on the table has been honored by & majority of the House. It contains such principles as I believe ought to govern in the settlement of this grand ques tion. Whether the place which hai been moved for is the right one, is a matter yet to be decided. Taking the Atlantic coast for a guide, the Sufquehanna involves undoubtedly the center of wealth, population and territory- All that has been said of the western territory has not induced me to wish that all that immense country should be brought into view. The resolution holds out an idea that the Atlantic States fliouldgo as near that country as their own convenience would al low. I his is all I expeCt or hope for. lam convinced that to go farther weft than this point of convenience, would be to injure the Western Territory itfelf. The question feem.s to lie between the Sufquehanna and Pawtomac. The center which I contemplate J *es between them, at nearly equal distances, but rather nearer the latter. lam pretty well acquainted with both rivers. He then gave a geographical description of those rivers, which to avoid any poflible errors, we shall not attempt to trace. The description related to their several advantages of communication with the Western Territory. In his calculation he considered Pittsburgh as the key of that Territory ; and that the advantages ol one river of the other mulVbe determined, by its relation to the place. Therefultof his detail was a concluGon clearly in favor of the Patowmac. To do justice to the committee, he said, I mnft declare that there is no comparison between the advantages of one communication and the other, with respeCt to the Ohio Country. Patowmac will no doubt, one day, be a' very important channel into thqfe regions. He concluded by observing, that though he thought that the Patowmac was nearer that centre of communication between the Atlantic and the Ohio, than the Sufquehanna, as there was no prospeCt ol a decision in favor of the former, he should give his vote for the Sufquehanna. In this situation, as he was a native of Pennsylvania, there was a certain duty which he owed to his coun try. and which he should now perform.
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